This week on the SHIPSHAPE.PRO podcast we interview Andrew Bardone, a liveaboard out of Norfolk, VA. Andrew threw off the shackles of traditional American comfort to pursue his dreams of adventure. After purchasing a Pearsen Sailboat, he started his undertaking of a refit to prepare the boat for adventure. We hear his experience on subjects such as minimalism to the dichotomy of relationships on the water. Get ready for a thrilling discussion!

Transcript —-

Talha [00:00:00] Shiver me timbers. You’re listening to that shipshape podcast podcast. Welcome, everybody. You’re tuned into the Shipshape podcast. This is Talha and with me I have most read and today we have a special guest, fellow Liveaboard, and his name is Andrew Bordone. He’s I’ve only met him recently, but I imagine he’s been doing a lot of this Marine stuff for a while. He’s very hands on. He’s involved in a lot of projects. And let’s let’s hear from him. Andrew, tell us a little bit about yourself. Welcome to the show.

 

Andrew [00:00:34] Thanks for having me. Yeah, like I mentioned, I am a liveaboard. Obviously, that’s what the show is kind of tailored to, but probably a little bit different than most little boards in the sense that I like to get real hands on. And I’m pretty much tore my boat to pieces and rebuild it the way I want it. So outside of that, I’m a civil engineer by trade, trying to shift into 100% sailing around the world by trade. So that’s that’s one of the things I’m working on at the moment. Yeah, thanks. Thanks for having me, guys.

 

Merrill [00:01:05] So, Andrew, you know, obviously knowing your bio, you were a correctional deputy and then you took some zigs and zags and then you ended up doing civil engineering. So how exactly did you get into boating? Did you grow up sailing? Were you raised on a boat? What’s the story behind that now?

 

Andrew [00:01:24] Right. So growing up, I had only been on out sailing one time in my life. It was in Santa Barbara. And my my grandparents took me out on a whale watching kind of crew, I guess you call it a cruise on a big old giant catamaran. And I remember absolutely loving it. I remember laying out on the net and just falling in love with being out at sea. And I didn’t really ever go sailing since then. I just kind of forgot about it. But it always kind of stuck in the back of my head a little bit. And it wasn’t until I moved out here to Norfolk after finishing my degree that I decided I need to pursue this this sailing lifestyle. So I took a class like most people that have no clue about sailing do. It was like it was one of those essay Cool Boat 100 entry courses, and I was I was absolutely hooked. I got out on the water and I, I figured out real quick that this is exactly where I need to be. So here I am.

 

Merrill [00:02:21] Was it the community that that got you to? Was it being on the water? I mean, really, what kind of what was the mentality that you were having that you’re like, okay, this is a good decision.

 

Andrew [00:02:33] So it was definitely being out in the water. It was the feeling of freedom and knowing that, like you can hop on a sailboat and there are no limits. You can take off tomorrow and just go as far as you want. That’s what really drew me in the independence of it. The community was a bonus as I started to get to know people and start to figure out what the sailing family is like or just the the boating family in general. It’s a tight community, especially with a liveaboard. We all kind of look out for each other. It’s very social on one end and it’s very antisocial. I don’t know if that’s the right word. Very solitude on the other end. You know, we love to get together and be together, but at the same time we’ll all disappear every once in a while. And I think that’s part of the sailboat lifestyle. We’re all we all can be. We’re all introverts, I think, but not so much when it comes to our own type of people.

 

Talha [00:03:28] And you’re right that there’s definitely a certain sort of wave and everybody has sort of, you know, crossed some bridge to end up on a boat and made life choices that enable that. So with regards to some of the sacrifices you had to make and people obviously have to cross bridges to end up on a boat, but like just in terms of lifestyle changes and maybe even minimalism, because that’s a big part of boating and living on a boat especially. How did you adjust and adapt all of that?

 

Andrew [00:03:56] So with minimalism, I never really saw that as a sacrifice. I saw that as more of a pro to the to the whole situation. When I was a sheriff’s deputy, I did, you know, the normal American lifestyle. I had the home. I had all the staff, you know, spent tons of money. And when I decided to leave that go back to school, I sold everything, sold the house, sold all my possessions. And when I was doing that, I started realizing, like all the crap that I actually had things that were just stored away and I hadn’t even seen in years. And I thought, Why do I even own this? So in that aspect, the minimalism thing totally appealed to me. I was like, I never want to go down that road again. And I tried to really take that to an extreme where I said to myself, If I don’t use it once a week, I don’t need to own it. I’d love to even go further than that and say if I don’t use it once a day, I don’t need to own it. But that’s pretty tough. So that that I liked. So I had to sacrifice, I guess the. Normal American mentality of how you should live life and that that can be difficult, especially when it comes to meeting other people, because it’s it’s abnormal. It’s not what most people want to do. It’s kind of pushing against everything. So like even your your normal dating life or just, you know, thinking, okay, I would love to meet somebody and I still would love to have a life partner, then that becomes a little bit difficult because I think people have this this idea that, Oh, you got a boat, you must have you know, women are just falling over each other. And that’s not really the case. I mean, maybe certain types of women.

 

Talha [00:05:39] Maybe, maybe we just got know into.

 

Andrew [00:05:42] Maybe that maybe the ship has sailed. Yeah. But I think I think the reaction I get most of the time is it’s people think, Oh, that’s a dream. That sounds amazing. You’re out of your mind. I could never do that because most people want the white picket fence and the 2.5 children and the nice nest egg, and they don’t want to live very far from their family. So that’s, I feel, is definitely been a sacrifice. You narrow the pool of people that think on your wavelength really quickly.

 

Merrill [00:06:16] Oh, I feel you on that one. How old are you anyway, Andrea?

 

Andrew [00:06:19] I just turned 40 this year. 40? Yeah, I’m getting older.

 

Talha [00:06:23] I’m too old for it right now, You know, at 40. So do you enjoy it then, overall, like, is it is it something you’d recommend to other people?

 

Andrew [00:06:31] I recommend it. If it is, you have to really, really love it because it’s not an easy lifestyle.

 

Talha [00:06:39] And so you’re talking about like living abroad completely.

 

Andrew [00:06:42] Right. Yeah. I mean, anybody can have a boat and kind of just go out for a week and sail it once in a while. That’s not really that hard. But to, to take go take it to the next level and live on the boat, you better really be in love with it because it’s a love hate relationship. If the the love for the lifestyle doesn’t trump the hate, you can, you’ll never do it. It’s just it’s almost an obsession.

 

Talha [00:07:05] Describe it, Delta. It’s more about What do you mean? What is this, a love hate relationship?

 

Andrew [00:07:09] So I wake up every morning and the first thing I think about is my boat. And usually when I’m at work, I’m thinking about my boat.

 

Talha [00:07:16] And thinking about my boat.

 

Andrew [00:07:17] I love it. And when I come home every day, I’m working on my boat. It’s almost like having a child. In fact. I mean, I’ve never I don’t have kids, so I can’t say this for sure, but I think maybe sometimes this is harder than having a child because it always need your attention and.

 

Talha [00:07:32] It can sink at any given moment.

 

Andrew [00:07:33] And it’s a whole lot more expensive.

 

Merrill [00:07:36] On my on my dating app. I say I don’t have a dog or a child. I just have a boat.

 

Andrew [00:07:42] Yeah.

 

Talha [00:07:42] And mutually, that’s the responsibility. But is that it then? Is that the sort of love hate part of it, The hatred part is just the responsibility attached to it or.

 

Andrew [00:07:53] No, even that I don’t hate. I don’t know if I’ve really found anything that I hate about it. There’s things that are definitely challenging, but like I said, you have to it has to almost be an obsession. Like you have to love it, otherwise you probably won’t be able to do it.

 

Merrill [00:08:09] So are you afraid of sharks now?

 

Andrew [00:08:13] So and so. I grew up in California and we frequented our summers going to a little town called Pismo, Pismo Beach, which is on the central coastline. And we’d swim all day long in the water. Pismo Beach is known to be one of the largest great white breeding areas in the world. It’s where they go to to make every season. So swimming in the water with unknown, whatever was a frequent occurrence from a very young age. So I never was really afraid of that. I’ll swim in just about anything except my marina, but I look at it more as a statistics thing, and that’s how I approach a lot of things. In life. You’re more likely to get struck by lightning than to get eaten by sharks in the ocean. So I figure, you know, I drive to work every day. The odds are I’ll get in a car accident, die that way, not swimming around the water or not sailing or doing any of the things that I really love.

 

Talha [00:09:09] You know, thing.

 

Merrill [00:09:10] I’m sure I need to work on on my swimming form because I probably look like a wounded seal.

 

Andrew [00:09:16] That’s what they’re attracted to. You just can’t flop.

 

Talha [00:09:20] And so then how does one sort of like given the fear of seemingly lots of people are just like afraid of like being out there on a boat? Like, how does one overcome a fear like that?

 

Andrew [00:09:30] I think it’s all about how you approach it. I think if that’s the case, then approach it as a challenge to get over. You know, I don’t love heights sometimes going for I mean, going for a hike on top of the mountain, you get to that that cliff edge or just climbing my mast. It’s not my favorite thing to do, but it’s not going to stop me. It’s something that I feel like the more I do it, the more it’ll be less I’ll be less fearful of it. And that can that kind of goes with anything in life the more you do it. Be as scary unless you just have, like, that mental phobia. And then, yeah, I don’t know what to tell you. Then you.

 

Merrill [00:10:06] Got the. You got the boat. So what is your dream adventure with the boat? What do you plan on doing?

 

Andrew [00:10:12] I mean, it’s not even a dream. It’s. It’s the reality of what I’m going to do, and that’s I’m going to start selling all over the world. The goal, the short term goal right now. And I don’t try to set too many long term goals as far as where I want to go, kind of like it to be just where I feel like going at the time. But I do know to kind of kick it off. I plan on this fall heading south and down to Florida and then coming across the Bahamas and maybe spending a year or two just island hopping down in the Bahamas, the Caribbean. I think one of the the big goals there, I don’t know when I’ll do it, is I’d like to sell out past the Arctic Circle.

 

Talha [00:10:47] All the way.

 

Merrill [00:10:48] We know one of our friends did that. He recently got hit by a train now.

 

Andrew [00:10:53] Oh, wow. Yeah. There. He gave.

 

Talha [00:10:56] It to us for.

 

Andrew [00:10:57] It. Yeah. Not past the Arctic Circle, though.

 

Talha [00:11:00] You know, it happened in Boston. Unfortunately, that.

 

Andrew [00:11:05] Sucks. But at least he did it. At least that’s. That’s pretty awesome accomplishment. No, not very many people sail up that far.

 

Talha [00:11:12] Exactly. He’s one of the first few individuals in the world. I mean, Yeah.

 

Andrew [00:11:16] All number of people.

 

Talha [00:11:18] So to tell us what sort of I mean, you’ve only been doing this a few years, but what sort of just keeping your dream adventure in mind? How how are you planning to or to what sort of advice would you give to somebody who wants to do something about that sail the world so.

 

Andrew [00:11:33] The make sure your boat is ready. That’s the the number one. There’s there’s certain things that you should have on a boat, too.

 

Talha [00:11:41] What do you mean?

 

Andrew [00:11:41] You make.

 

Talha [00:11:42] It so.

 

Andrew [00:11:43] So that certain systems on your boat just to make I mean obviously there is danger involved in anything you do so you can do things to reduce that amount of danger. For me personally, I want to have autopilot on the boat. I want to have a good navigation system on the boat. Beyond that, I’m pretty I’m super adamant about being off grid because it’s not cheap to go down and live in the Bahamas. If you’ve got to stay at a marina or even Florida for that matter, it costs a fortune. The state Marine is down there. So I’m trying I mean, cooking my boat so that I don’t ever have to stay in the marina if I don’t want to. So that’s a big part of it. Save a little at least some kind of bankroll just to have in case something happens. Plan on trying to make money while you’re doing it, but just take the plunge and do it. You’ll always think of a thousand reasons not to, and usually all those reasons will keep you from doing it. It’s kind of just takes saying, okay, I’m going and just doing it.

 

Merrill [00:12:44] So getting to, you know, your whole experience with getting a boat, how exactly did you find a boat? You know, what were the you know, did you go on yacht world? Did you do a lot of research? How did you find it?

 

Andrew [00:12:57] So I was I don’t know. I might be a little bit different. I mean, obviously everybody gets on Yacht World and looks at all the boats to kind of get an idea of prices, I guess, for me. So I did what a lot of people do when they think they might need a sailing. And you start you start watching YouTube videos of these pretty cool people out there that are actually living the dream. They’re going out there and they’re doing it. And that is that was one of the things that kind of inspired me. I was like, Well, if they can do it, why the hell I And through doing that, I fell in love with a specific boat and I thought, that thing’s awesome. It can handle just about anything you throw at it. It’s not insanely huge, so you can solo hand. So I knew the exact boat that I wanted going into it that made it a little bit tougher, I think, because this boat, there’s not thousands of them out there. It’s not a Beneteau, it’s not, you know. So I got on Facebook and I put out a message. I said, Hey, this is the boat I’m looking for. If anybody knows anybody that’s selling one should me message. And I immediately got a response. This guy was like, Hey, my buddy’s got one. He’s not looking to sell it, but he might talk to them. So I called that. I called him up. I said, You know, this is I got your name from a friend of yours. He said, You got this boat. Do you ever think about selling it? He said, John, maybe. He said, it’s it’s been sitting on my driveway on the cards for about six years now, and I hate to see it. Just sit there. Why don’t you come up and look at it? So it was up in Cape Cod, so I drove up. We hit it off. He really just wanted to know that his boat was going to go to somebody that would love it as much as he did, and he wanted to see his boat get used. So he sold it to me and it was pretty easy. I’ve grown up pretty mechanically inclined, so and I did a lot of research as to what you kind of want to look for on a new boat. And so I didn’t get a survey because I didn’t really want to deal with that. And I I’ve heard from people that the survey is a good thing to have, but a lot of surveyors will really just tear boats apart, even if there’s not a whole lot wrong with them just to kind of validate why you’re giving them 500 bucks. So I didn’t go. That route, and I don’t regret it. This boat is about as solid as a boat. So you could ask for.

 

Talha [00:15:05] And what? What boat is it? One year. And so.

 

Andrew [00:15:07] I’ve got a 1973 Pearson P 36.

 

Talha [00:15:11] Winchester. And so why do you ask people? I mean, it’s a personal choice and a lot of people go for older boats, as you have. What’s the thought process there?

 

Andrew [00:15:20] So the reason I was drawn towards older boats and I talked to a lot of people, a lot a lot of old sailors that have been doing a long time. And they they kind of pointed me in that direction. The era of boat building during that early to mid seventies was an early era for fiberglass use, and they built boat builders, loved fiberglass, but they didn’t know the effects of longevity of fiberglass in the water. So they built the hell out of it. They they built the hulls about as thick as you’ll ever see. I mean, my hulls almost one inch thick, pure fiberglass. So they just built them like tanks because they’re like, Well, we think it’ll work fine. We’re not sure. Just put 1,000% on whatever we think it might be, and then we know it’ll last forever. So they built these air boats just to be as strong as you could possibly ask for.

 

Talha [00:16:13] And so as the years went on, then, did they start like removing layers, basically realizing that they were going to last for thousands of years?

 

Andrew [00:16:22] Yeah. They like kind of beneath look, I mean, it’s you compare it to vehicles, you look at a car that was built in the fifties and it’s indestructible. And you look at a modern day car and most of it’s plastic. So they they figured out, okay, what is the the bare minimum to increase our profit margins that we have to build these boats at. So you look at a modern day boat like, you know, nothing against Beneteau. I’m sure that people, after they have their beautiful boats, but the holes are less Enron. So to me, that’s I’m sure they’re fine. They’ll probably last just as long as my boat. But I have this I have the feeling of the comfort of knowing that this boat will last a lot longer than I’ll be around. Hmm.

 

Talha [00:17:01] True.

 

Merrill [00:17:02] When you were looking at boats, you know, you said that you knew what to look for. What were you looking for?

 

Andrew [00:17:09] So there were several things, because I knew I wanted to sell this boat around the world. One, I had to have a a kill step mass. That was crucial. And what that means is there’s two types of mass. There’s deck step, there’s skill step. A deck step will sit on top of the deck of the boat. Sometimes there’s a tension pull underneath to kind of take some of the the way to the max and some of the pressure, the downward pressure. A kill step mass goes through the decks and it sits directly on top of the kill. So it’s just a lot beefier. It’s a lot more solid. The displacement is a little bit better, just stronger in general. Most blue water boats are made with a keel stepped mast. The other thing I was looking for was a certain type of keel, either one of them on a hole or I wanted a fin keel and I wanted a nice deep draft. So the draft is how basically how deep your keel goes down underneath the boat. So this boat has a fin keel with a six foot deep draft, which is a lot. There’s pros and cons to it. It’s got nice displacement. So I’m pretty confident that this boat would never capsize. It might tip over, but it will probably write itself immediately just because there’s so much weight underneath the boat. The con is six foot deep, so there’s a lot of shallow areas, especially down the Bahamas, down in Florida, you’re limited on some of those the areas that you can get to just because of how deep it is.

 

Merrill [00:18:31] Are you a a fin spade rudder or you skate rudder?

 

Andrew [00:18:36] I’ve got a shag rudder, so it’s protected. So that was another thing that I ruling.

 

Talha [00:18:40] All these terms around what he was talking about.

 

Merrill [00:18:42] So the spade rudder is like a the rudder comes through the underneath. It’s just kind of like a a free flowing, unprotected right where the this gag is a part of the hull kind of comes alongside it to protect it from any damage. Now, I’ve heard I’ve heard tons of stories of of people losing their spade rudder because they they run into some object. The Skegg rudder is just like an extra layer, like a fiberglass guard, essentially, that protects the rudder from any type of damage that you could run into.

 

Andrew [00:19:18] I mean, either either case would be it it would be hard to tell you right or off, I think, because it’s typically your keels right in front of it. If you’re going to hit something, it’s probably going be with your keel first. But there are cases you got where your keel misses it and it just rip your rudder off. It’s nice having the sag. That’s again, I don’t a lot of modern boats are built this big rudder and they’re built with spade rudder and it’s less expensive to build them that way.

 

Merrill [00:19:42] When you first got your boat, what problems did you face initially when you first got it? Like what repairs did you have to do? Was there anything?

 

Andrew [00:19:50] So I didn’t really have any problems. There was definitely jobs that I wanted to tackle right away, so I didn’t even put her in the water. When I first got her, I had her. Knocked down the mast was already dropped. So I thought, Well, I can go up to Cape Cod. I could step the mast. The rigging had been down. I mean, like I said, it had been sitting on his driveway for about six years, so I didn’t feel like it was really a great idea to reset the mast, cut all the rigging up, and then sell it down from Cape Cod in Norfolk. I was going to have any problems. That’s that’s a decent distance through some not so great waters. So I tracked her down. I immediately put her on the heart, and I spent the first six months redoing the entire bottom. So I sanded it down completely. I replaced all the through holes below the waterline because they originally. They were all bronze through holes. Bronze is nice. Old bronze. Not so much. It’ll kind of turn a pinkish color. And that’s when you know that the bronze is kind of starting to go bad. It becomes very brittle at that point. So I just pulled them all, replaced them with new through holes, repainted the bottom. And then while I was doing that, I replaced all of the standing rigging on the entire boat. And I even had the back stay in the two upper shroud. So I update one size. Knowing that it’s going to take an awful lot to take this mass down, I would have to have major hurricane winds to snap one of these rigs.

 

Merrill [00:21:13] I must have.

 

Andrew [00:21:15] That.

 

Merrill [00:21:15] That must have been a pretty good price tag.

 

Andrew [00:21:18] Yeah, it was. I mean, I did it all myself, so that saved me a lot of money. I’d say maybe about five grand to redo all the rigging, all the standing rigging and redo the bottom. So it wasn’t horrible. If I had hired somebody to do it, it probably would cost double that for sure.

 

Talha [00:21:35] Yeah. On a good day. Yeah. Yeah. And so but going back to Newton’s about, like, what you made you decide on this boat, what other factors were there that made this a blue water friendly boat?

 

Andrew [00:21:48] Those are the main things. The keel and the mast. I mean, that’s she’s a she’s got a really wide beam, which I like. She’s got a 12 foot beam.

 

Talha [00:21:57] What about the living.

 

Andrew [00:21:58] Waterline.

 

Talha [00:22:00] Or like, stuff like that, or you’re just not even concerned about stuff like that.

 

Andrew [00:22:03] I mean, I liked how open the layout was, but that was more for like a living factor. Not so much as far as how to accomplish sailing around the world because, I mean, on any boat, I was probably going to almost get the interior anyways and make it how I wanted it, which is kind of what I’ve started I’ve been doing on this boat. I cut back a lot of bunks. I opened the whole main cabin. So it’s big, wide open, spacious. Some sailors, especially some of the more traditional sellers, tell me I’m crazy. Like, what the hell are you going to hang on to if this boat’s healed over 30 degrees? But I’ve done things to kind of compensate for that as well. But yeah, I wanted to make sure that she was a solid boat that could handle just about any situation. So those were the the two main areas that I wanted to make sure that I had.

 

Merrill [00:22:52] What were some of the major projects that you’ve done already on the boat? I heard that you were going to change it up the whole interior and kind of building it from scratch. What have you done.

 

Andrew [00:23:03] So, so far? I I’ve completely I completely gutted the head, which is the bathroom on a boat down to the hull, tore out all the cabinets, toilet, everything. It was just an empty shell and I was done with it. So I rebuilt all the cabinetry in there. I installed a new toilet, an all electric mastering toilet, getting ready to work on the shower. It’s a wet bath, so I’m getting ready to work on the shower right now. This last winter I installed a wood burning stove in the main cabin area, which I absolutely love. Getting ready to build a new freezer box and install a new refrigerator. What else have I done? It seems like it’s a never ending gainer. Been redoing the entire electrical system as I’ve been going. Redid all the plumbing when I tore the toilet out, tore out all the old sanitation hose. Replace that with all new. Yeah, it’s. I mean, the list is just it’s long.

 

Talha [00:23:56] And this is the lists of this already happened. And then you also have some future plans incorporating solar and maybe swapping out your engine. I heard.

 

Andrew [00:24:06] Yeah, I guess on two major projects in the future. So I’m definitely here in the next couple of months. When I was solar made, I mean, I like to do everything myself, but when it comes to welding stainless, I want to look nice, so I’m not going to do that and then install solar panels. I want to put a large battery bank on the boat because the future goal, I don’t know when this will happen. It’ll be probably a few years down the line is to to pull the diesel motor out and replace that with an electric motor.

 

Talha [00:24:35] Nice.

 

Andrew [00:24:36] Yeah. That, that’s part of my 100% off grid process which will include fuel.

 

Talha [00:24:44] Yup. Basically, then you’re producing your own fuel if you have enough solar.

 

Andrew [00:24:47] Yeah. I mean, granted, I would still have to get fuel for the deal, but I don’t look at that any different than having to go in and get groceries. You don’t have to be at a marina to do that. I can dig in and. Get whatever I need.

 

Talha [00:24:59] And isn’t that becoming more mainstream isn’t on one of these YouTube celebrity types also testing out an electric powered solar thing out in the middle of nowhere?

 

Andrew [00:25:10] Yep. Yep. Selling humor is a big one.

 

Talha [00:25:13] And they are in that way.

 

Andrew [00:25:16] Yeah, they they stripped out. That was the first thing they did when they and we actually had the same boat. There’s this one year older than mine. They’ve been a lot of the inspiration for what I’m doing. I’ve been seeing what they’ve achieved, which a lot of people told them initially. You’re out of your minds and I’m seeing them do it. And I’m just like, okay, well, again, if they can do it, why can’t I? So yeah, they’ve been a huge inspiration for all this. Interesting.

 

Merrill [00:25:39] So I’m long. Have you actually owned the boat for?

 

Andrew [00:25:43] It’ll be two years this November.

 

Merrill [00:25:46] I know. Time starts to lose. Meaning when you’re on a boat?

 

Andrew [00:25:49] Yeah. You had days. I’m really bad about even what day of the week it is anymore. You kind.

 

Talha [00:25:56] Of have to get more people into this because.

 

Andrew [00:25:59] You start shifting more into seasons. Not really days. Weeks.

 

Talha [00:26:04] True. But in in those few years, then, like, you’ve obviously already had some sailing adventures. What what’s been your funnest sailing adventure so far?

 

Andrew [00:26:13] Oh, gosh. So I think a real fun one was last the last 4th of July, me and a couple of family members sailed up the Elizabeth River and anchored out at a little little area called Hospital Point and watched the fireworks over Norfolk City. That was that was pretty amazing. Really enjoyed that. Done a lot of trips up to Cape Charles. Those are always fun.

 

Talha [00:26:37] And so what makes for a good day of sailing that you want?

 

Andrew [00:26:41] GOODWIN But not too much wind. So 10 to 15 knots is perfect. It’s comfortable. You’re you’re easily hit and your whole speed at that point but you’re not out there heeled over 30 degrees the whole time. The waves aren’t too choppy. Good weather on a hot day. It’s not too fun. I was there last July. I was doing the Cape Charles race and we had no in that day and it was hotter than hell. That wasn’t fun. I didn’t enjoy that.

 

Talha [00:27:08] But would any of those sailing days make a top five moment for you?

 

Andrew [00:27:12] So it depends. Like top five, like good sailing, top five. Exciting.

 

Talha [00:27:18] Okay. The categories, I mean, how you want to take that, you dummy try.

 

Andrew [00:27:22] So we’re talking like excitement there. Yeah, I can think of a handful. So me and a couple buddies attempted to sell up to Annapolis this this year, this last year for the Annapolis boat show. And we’ve been planning this trip for, I don’t know, about a month. We knew we were going and we were planning for two days to get up to Annapolis, but around in Annapolis for the day and then a couple of days to get back. And we got hit with this pretty good storm, the weekend that we were leaving. And we were still determined. We were like, now we’re we’re doing this. We got to go. We’ve only got a couple of days to get up there. So we left was a Sunday morning and I remember when we left, there was a few people that were poking their heads out, their their cockpits, looking at us like, Where the hell are you going? Are you out of your minds? And we get out on the bay and it’s it’s blowing 30 and we’re hit and we’ve got to get three meter waves just slam and against us.

 

Talha [00:28:19] Three meter?

 

Andrew [00:28:20] Yeah. It was not fun. I mean, it was just beaten the hell out of the boat. So the first day we made it as far as Hampton, which is if you know the Norfolk area, Hampton is about a 20 minute drive from Norfolk. So we got out there like, this is insane and we got back here as fast as we could and we did that for three days just on it, fought it and it was not fun. The waves were erratic. It was like you had to just be fully concentrated the entire time because their waves were just coming from everywhere. And we made it as far as Greenville, which is right on the York River. And we we said, well, there’s no way we’re going to make it to Annapolis. So if we still want to go the boat show, we’ve got to turn around and head back and then we’ll drive up to the boat show. So we turned around and made it back to Norfolk in about 6 hours. And it was one of the most beautiful sailing days I’ve ever had.

 

Talha [00:29:14] On the way back where you weren’t fighting everything.

 

Andrew [00:29:17] Down. So everything had calmed down by the end and it was like, This is perfect. Why couldn’t we have had this the last three days? Nice. But that’s selling. That’s if we if you try to to sell on a schedule, we’ll always lose.

 

Talha [00:29:31] And who was this in your boat? It was somebody else’s.

 

Andrew [00:29:33] No, no. This one was on my buddies boat.

 

Talha [00:29:36] Okay. Okay. And have you had the boat long enough to, like, have this one project that, you know, maybe it was like the most expensive or the biggest or, you know, what? What would that be?

 

Andrew [00:29:46] Probably the the bottom doing. The bottom is the most expensive so far. The electrical system. That’s pretty pricey. I’ve bought most of what I need other than the batteries to redo the entire electrical system. On the boat. The batteries are going to be a lot. Those lithium batteries aren’t cheap, so I’m probably going to buy those. Yeah, I’ll buy those probably for a time until I get my my 12 kbps battery bank.

 

Talha [00:30:10] Nice. Okay.

 

Merrill [00:30:11] So have you taken the out a lot of people that don’t know anything about sailing, have you taken out friends and how were their reactions to bringing people out on the water? I know from my experience, you know, I would invite people, you know, thinking that everyone would come out on the boat. And then once you have the boat, no one ends up actually coming out. Or maybe I’m just weird.

 

Andrew [00:30:35] But, you know, I’ve definitely taken people out sailing. It’s not fun, though. I. I don’t really enjoy it. Usually it’s just. I mean, when you take somebody I never met sailing, they have no clue what they’re doing. And so you end up doing a lot of work, which I don’t mind. I actually enjoy solo sailing. I think it’s a lot of fun, but solar sailing is a whole lot less work than taking out a handful of people that are never been on a boat for because they just get in the way and you’re worried about somebody falling over. Stressful. Yeah. Whether they bring stuff usually with them that you shouldn’t bring on a boat.

 

Talha [00:31:14] What are some of those things to avoid being in a boat?

 

Andrew [00:31:17] Oh, there’s a couple of things. One, you don’t bring red wine on a boat that has a big name you don’t bring. This is one that kind of is a pet peeve of mine. And I don’t know if anybody else has ever noticed four but Cheetos don’t bring Cheetos on a boat because that orange dust that you get all over your fingers, it stains everything.

 

Talha [00:31:38] Hmm.

 

Andrew [00:31:39] But red wine is the worst because somebody will spread spilled red wine and it will stay in your hall. Your desk?

 

Talha [00:31:46] Yeah. And boats are white.

 

Merrill [00:31:47] Yeah. There’s been plenty of times where we’ve waxed the boats. And I guess now that I think about it, it wasn’t rust stains. It could have been Cheetos stains.

 

Andrew [00:31:55] Yeah, little kid, Finger Cheetos stains.

 

Talha [00:32:00] And what sort of. So you’ve had good experiences, bad experiences. It does seem like strange, weird experiences that you didn’t expect you’d have. Like, did you see? Have you seen UFOs? I don’t.

 

Andrew [00:32:10] Know. I haven’t seen any UFOs. I’d love to. I have seen bioluminescence even here in the Chesapeake Bay.

 

Talha [00:32:18] Tell us more about that. And what was that like? I’ve heard it’s beautiful.

 

Andrew [00:32:22] It is. It’s awesome. And I’ll tell you where I saw it wasn’t out on the water. Like out sailing. We see that nice glow behind the boat as the motors turn in. I saw it in my buddy’s toilet when I flushed.

 

Talha [00:32:35] Oh, boy.

 

Andrew [00:32:36] A little swirly gook and flushing down the toilet. That’s the only time I’ve seen bioluminescence here.

 

Talha [00:32:44] My God.

 

Andrew [00:32:44] What else? Weird things that I’ve seen. Not so much weird, but a lot of pretty sea life. I’ve seen loggerhead turtles out here in the bay. I mean, dolphins, I don’t know, a hundred times. Haven’t seen a whale yet, but I’ve heard they come out here in the bay sometimes. Yeah, but you do experience weird things on a boat. Like things that I had never even thought about before. I remember. So my first summer, living here on the boat, you hear noises on the bottom of your hall, and it really freaked me out. The first time I heard it, I thought, Oh my God, I’ve got a leak somewhere. This is what’s going on. Okay, So there’s there’s two things you’ll hear that at least that I’ve heard. One, you’ll hear like a small cracking sound. And I guess after asking around and Googling, it is it’s like a small shrimp that’s feeding on the bottom of your boat in the algae buoy.

 

Talha [00:33:30] Then you could hear the small shrimp feeding on the outside.

 

Andrew [00:33:33] Yeah, it’s like a little like it sounds like Rice Krispies in your milk. And then the other speaker and I thought, Yeah, my boat’s sinking for sure is this is laying there at night one night and I hear this loud gurgle like air rolling up the hall. And what it is, is it’s as the hot day as the temperatures changing. The silt and mud under the water are releasing big air bubbles. We’re told it’s sometimes it’s even like a like methane gases. So you’ll hear that come up, hit the bottom of your hall and roll up. And if you don’t know what it is, you’re you’re convinced that you’re boat.

 

Merrill [00:34:07] Sitting in Boston Harbor. We have all these, like, tankers that come through these huge tankers, and they go right by the boat. And in the beginning, I could hear this like, you know, it did it sounded like water was coming into the boat. So I’d be like crawling across the floor, you know, trying to figure out where the hell I was coming from in a panic, like sweating. And it took me a little bit of time to realize that I was hearing the propeller of these gigantic tankers that were coming by, and they were just.

 

Andrew [00:34:38] Oh, yeah, through the.

 

Merrill [00:34:39] Water and just echo inside the boat.

 

Andrew [00:34:41] Yeah. Sound travels pretty far underwater. Well, I guess now that I’m thinking about the one really cool thing I’ve seen on a couple of occasions, one, I was I was up the Elizabeth River and I was in not my boat. I was in a little like a 20 foot harbor tow just out. Around on the Elizabeth. And I look over and about 20 feet from me was a nuclear submarine just slink. And by that that was pretty wild. And then all of a sudden, all the patrol boats around it were yelling at me, maintain 500 yards or 500 feet, sorry. And then on on another occasion, so on to take Charles and I had just crossed the channel. I mean, just had crossed it minutes by and the entire naval fleet was coming in right behind me. That was pretty neat. It was, you know, couple quick carriers, bunch of battleships, nuclear submarine. I mean, if I had been 5 minutes slower, I would had to turn around and go back. I would have never made it across the channel. But that was pretty neat to see. As one thing about living in Norfolk, she’ll see a lot of big naval ships. You can probably you guys might hear it right now. They play Cadence every night.

 

Talha [00:35:48] So, Andrew So you’ve done this enough where maybe you again, you can like you’ve given us tips about what to look for in a boat. But once you’ve got it, like how do you survive on one, especially, again, like a bunch of years keeping your dreams intact to see the rest of the world while sailing? How do you do it?

 

Andrew [00:36:05] Learn to sacrifice. Sacrifice. So unless you’re buying a brand new boat, like if you’re buying a boat that you plan on working on and making it your own, you’re going to have to sacrifice some some creature habits. I mean, I spent, I don’t know, three months pissing off the side of my boat because I didn’t have a toilet installed yet. And I you know, if I had to do anything else, I had to go to the bathroom. So, you know, there’s certain creature habits that you you might enjoy living on land that you probably won’t have. I mean, obviously the toilets, but you got to have a toilet on the boat. But there’s other things that Internet is always kind of an issue. You probably won’t have the best Internet living on a boat. So get used to having slow Wi-Fi. Gosh, what else? The the weather is an issue. Unless you you have means to stay warm and you’re in a cold area. You’re getting a cold if you don’t like rocking to sleep every night.

 

Talha [00:36:56] That’s an issue. I wanted to ask you about that previously. Yeah. Is there lots of people describe the sleeping they’ve gotten in a boat as the best sleep they gotten? Is that true for you?

 

Andrew [00:37:05] Yeah, absolutely. I think the first three months that I lived on the boat, I was really tired all the time because it’s quite lethargic. You know, You’re just that gentle rock back and forth all the time. Now, I don’t even feel it. And same with In Reverse. I remember the first couple of months living on the boat and going out sailing. When you get off the boat, you can feel you got your legs and, you know, like wobbly that maybe not for everybody, but for me that that went away.

 

Talha [00:37:31] And how how soon was that for you? A few weeks.

 

Andrew [00:37:34] A couple of months, probably.

 

Merrill [00:37:36] Yeah. When I when I first started living on a boat, I was still in law school. So I would go to the class and I sat in the back because I was a bad student. And I would look at the board, I’d look at my screen and everything was wavy. I was like, Oh my God, what the hell’s going on? So I typed in a web MD. I was like, just on a boat and now on land. And everything’s like, my visuals are wavy. And, you know, of course, Web MD tells me that I have this chronic disease that I’ll have for the rest of my life.

 

Andrew [00:38:04] You’re having a stroke? Yeah.

 

Talha [00:38:08] Yeah, but any other survival tips, though?

 

Andrew [00:38:12] So I guess just always plan for something. You know, like one of the things that I spent some time doing before this winter and I still need to do a bit more is building like my my foul weather gear because I like sailing all seasons. I want to go out where it’s cold. And if you don’t have good weather gear, you’re just me miserable, me cold. You can be wet. Stuff like that. I have items like everybody should have a ditch bag and either they’ll be mine. And what that is, is just like the worst happens and you’ve got to get off the boat. Leave it behind. You need a bag that has stuff to sustain you while you’re doing that. That’s important. And I try to do that just not only in that scenario, but any scenario. I’ve got, you know, certain items that I know I want to have. Excuse my friend shit hits the fan.

 

Talha [00:38:56] And as I said, you can’t be looking for those items while the ship is hitting the fan. You have to be prepared.

 

Andrew [00:39:02] Exactly. Yeah. You’re living in probably the least hospitable environment. Aside from maybe living in, I don’t know, Mars. Yeah, Mars or Tibet. Like the ocean doesn’t like people. Really doesn’t like things that people make. It’s always fighting against you. So you have to kind of prepare for that environment. It’s not a happy environment where it’s saying, Yeah, come enjoy life on me now. It’s like, Well, you don’t belong here. Like you’re like your land animal. What are you doing out here?

 

Talha [00:39:31] So keeping that in mind then, Actually, I was going to go to West Orange Resort. Do you want to go into our storms again?

 

Merrill [00:39:36] Is it a different story than going to Baltimore or maybe.

 

Andrew [00:39:41] Going up to Annapolis? Probably. Well, I mean, aside from some storms that have come through.

 

Talha [00:39:47] So just in terms of like the, you know, survival survivability of the whole thing, like weather is obviously a big part of it. And you told us about the storm that you when you were going up to Baltimore. Any other crazy storms or.

 

Andrew [00:39:58] Yeah, especially here on the East Coast. We get hit with no resistance here every once in a while. This year we got one. It wasn’t horrible. It wasn’t the worst one that we’ve gotten here. But it’s still something that you have to prepare for. So and that’s kind of going back to you always. Have you planning? I’ve probably checked the weather. I don’t know. Every day I get on windy and see what the Wednesday when I look at the forecast and see what’s coming up coming my way. And if there’s a nasty storm coming in, unless I want to be up at 1:00 in the morning, running around the rain, checking my lines and adding extra lines, tying off something you want to prepare for in advance. You know, this last we had one pretty good storm. I think it was blowing. I want to say we were getting up to 60 knots and I went out a couple of days before I knew it was come in and I tied off my main sail real good. I wrapped it, took my Dodger off, made sure that the head was really secure and doubled up all my lines just in case one of them would break. So, yeah, that’s tough. I mean, in a house you just shut the door and. But do you enjoy being in.

 

Talha [00:41:01] Your favorite part of my marine experience? Do you enjoy storms?

 

Andrew [00:41:04] No, I don’t love the storms, to be honest. I think it’s a little different on on a sailboat versus a powerboat. So on a sailboat, during storms, even the best rigged mast, you get what’s called mast pumping. And I don’t love the way that feels kind of shakes.

 

Talha [00:41:20] And what is mathematically the whole mass is like moving side to side and there’s like a.

 

Andrew [00:41:25] Not so much side to side. I mean, yeah, it resonates. It’s almost like a harmonics so that the wind will come across the mass and cause kind of like some boats actually will get a vibration and you can actually hear the mast like humming and it can get quite loud. I think that’s usually the case if your your rigging is not tuned. Right. But all boats will get some sort of mast pump and that’s yeah, the mass will get it’ll start vibrating at a certain frequency and it’ll actually start pumping back and forth and you can feel it shake on the boat. And right now my mast, which this is an upcoming project I have to do, is the, the wires that are run internally in my mass are secure so I can hear the wires kind of flapping and stuff. Eventually you don’t really hear it kind of like any of anything else in life. Like you hear it enough and your brain just kind of tunes it out after a while. But during a good storm, you definitely hear it. And, you know, if you don’t tie your halyard off, you know, they’ll start slapping against the mast that you definitely hear. And all your neighbors hear that, too. So those of you boaters that are out there listening to your halyard off, if you have a.

 

Talha [00:42:31] Chance to talk to everyone.

 

Andrew [00:42:34] Nobody wants to hear that slapping all night long. Yeah.

 

Merrill [00:42:37] When the the wind comes screaming through the marina and it’s the the rigging of all the other sailboats there and it makes like this weird scream and, you know, I’d be sitting on my boat and sounds like you can hear, like, people whispering when just going through and, you know, the house. Yeah. Whispers of my name. I’m like, What the hell’s going on? You know? Spooky.

 

Andrew [00:42:59] Yeah. And it’s a trip. I mean, so some of the old timers, one of the old timers that I raced with, he said he was telling me a few years ago we had a it was a nor’easter and that was so big that the water got within about one inch from the top of the pylons. And that was like, Holy crap, what the hell do you do? Then that’s when lines start coming off and boats just start floating around the marina. That’s my biggest fear. And I thought kind of back and forth about that. If think maybe if there was a big enough storm coming through, I would probably I might leave the marina and find a a little cove somewhere and just drop out. Couple of anchors and a big storm anchor. That way I’m away from other boats. You’re going to have to be an anchor in a storm at some point, especially if you plan on doing what I plan on doing. My biggest fear is not what my boat’s going to do, because I’ll I’ll make sure that it’s not going to move. My fear is what other boats are going to do to my boat. Yes, I’ve seen some of the rigging. I’ve seen some of the docks lines on some of these boats. And it’s like, I don’t know how they stay attached under calm conditions.

 

Talha [00:44:05] And so how big a storm would warrant you leaving the dock there?

 

Andrew [00:44:09] I think if we were getting a boarding 80 knots, I might try to head head off place word. Interesting. Yeah, I would try to find some place where it’s not blowing that hard and find a safe little cove.

 

Talha [00:44:22] So then in keeping all of this in mind, any sort of pro tip with weather safety, perhaps.

 

Andrew [00:44:28] Have a good storm anchor and learn how to drop more than one anchor. I mean, a lot of people think you just put one anchor out and you’re good during a good hurricane, you should have at least two.

 

Talha [00:44:38] And you take the second one out. Unlike a dinghy or.

 

Andrew [00:44:41] So, you put one off your bow and one off your stern and you would. So you look at what direction the wind is coming from and try to line your boat up with the direction of that wind.

 

Merrill [00:44:50] So if you won the lottery, right, you won $10 million, what would you do with it? Would you buy another boat? To put a ton of money into the boat you got. What would you do?

 

Andrew [00:45:01] $10 million. I’d do both. So what’s it all about? I don’t see myself ever sailing this boat. Sailing is then like getting rid of it. This is one of my favorite boats. I kind of think of this as my Atlantic boat because I think it’s perfect for sailing around the Atlantic. The mad. I do want another boat, though. I want a Pacific boat because that’s a whole big one that I’d love to get. Like, I don’t know, 45 foot all steel sailboat, maybe take that guy down to the in the Antarctic.

 

Talha [00:45:32] That’s why that’s one of the expeditions to me do with that one.

 

Andrew [00:45:34] And that’s like unlimited on a good steel sailboat. I mean, you could go around the horn with that thing.

 

Talha [00:45:39] So what sort of gear do you recommend? Just maybe even on a day to day basis, small things. People forget the must haves, perhaps.

 

Andrew [00:45:48] It depends on your lifestyle, really. Like as far as safety. You know, I think we’ve probably touched on that. I mean, if you’re going to do long voyages, you should probably have a life raft, especially if you plan on crossing some oceans. I mean, it’s not a must, but it sure is nice. And I guess it would depend on how big the ocean is that you’re crossing.

 

Talha [00:46:06] And it’s also useful if you’re just sort of anchoring off somewhere you can just dinghy into town or get.

 

Andrew [00:46:11] We are talking about I’m talking about an actual life raft versus a dinghy, though, which means, of course, a dinghy is a must. Like, if you go on anywhere and you get where you want to anchor out, you’ve got to have a name that’s kind of like living on land and not owning a car. Like, it’s pretty tough. You can do it, but there’s not this. I guess there are some places where you can get a water taxi. I don’t know if that’s everywhere, but it’s kind of like having yachts. It’s your car. It’s how you go to get groceries. It’s how you go do laundry.

 

Merrill [00:46:40] So if you could do it all over again with all the knowledge that you have, how would you have done it differently? You know, whether it be buying the boat or the projects or what have you?

 

Andrew [00:46:51] I don’t think I would have done anything differently. I might have started someplace else, maybe further south. I love the people here in Norfolk as far as who are my neighbors. But the area itself, I’m not in love with. It’s not I mean, I don’t know. Some people say that the Bay is one of the best places in the world to sail. I kind of disagree after having sailed it for a couple of years now. The weather’s not always that great. It’s you have maybe four or five months of the year where you can go out and enjoy sailing. The rest of the time it’s usually raining or stormy or the you know, there’s a lot and a whole lot of marine traffic, big traffic that comes in and out, especially near where I’m at. So you know that cause a lot of chop, which isn’t usually that fun to sail around in. Like we don’t really get big swells here in the bay. We just get a lot of chop. See, I might have started for the South.

 

Merrill [00:47:46] What type of people have you met since you’ve been living on a boat?

 

Andrew [00:47:50] People like me. I think I touched on it earlier where living boards are a special breed. They’re. They’re introverts and they’re extroverts at the same time. There’s two types of boaters, actually. I’d say there’s, I guess four types. So there’s two types in terms of liveaboard and non liveaboard. And then there’s two types in terms of sailing and power boating and everybody has kind of their own vibe. I think LIVEABOARD power boaters are more similar to Liveaboard sailors just because we share that liveaboard aspect. But for pleasure crafts like just weekends, sailors, power boaters and sailors are drastically different.

 

Talha [00:48:29] What do you mean? How? What are some of the similarities and differences you’re talking about?

 

Andrew [00:48:33] So as far as similarities, little boards. Yeah, we all I think we’re all kind of going after the same lifestyle. We’re all minimalists because we just really can’t fit that much in our home. And that, I think, generally appeals to us. Otherwise we wouldn’t live on a boat and then we like to get away from normal society. I don’t know about everybody else, but most of the people I meet, they like to be on their boat. You know, we’ll go out and we’ll do things on land, but we really enjoy going back to our boat and being on the water. There’s seclusion to.

 

Talha [00:49:04] It. And then you said there was also a difference between bowerbirds and teal borders. And what lower distinction is that?

 

Andrew [00:49:10] I think the main distinction would be speed. It’s kind of like engines, but yeah, it’s kind of like somebody that owns like an old classic cruiser versus somebody that owns a souped up hot rod. They’re very different type people. They both enjoy cars. But what they want to do with that car’s completely different. One of them wants to go as fast as possibly can. The other one just enjoys restoring the car and cruising around in it. That’s very similar with power boaters versus sailors. A sailor enjoys working on his boat to make it look beautiful, bring it back to its glory and lights going out, putting around at five miles per hour on the bay or on the water tower. But he wants to put the biggest engines he can get on that sucker and get out there and rip around all day. True.

 

Merrill [00:49:57] So you’re telling me. That you’re going to be. You know, you’re cool just being a sailor. You don’t want to shift over to powerboats at some point.

 

Andrew [00:50:04] I have yet to find the appeal for me of power boating.

 

Talha [00:50:09] I wish I could.

 

Andrew [00:50:12] I know. Tell us. Like what? I think there’s some restrictions that I don’t want with power boating. The expense is one that’s a big one for me. It’s just the fuel is. It’s just cost so much.

 

Talha [00:50:25] And I’m sure and that is a limitation as well in terms of how far you can go as well.

 

Andrew [00:50:30] Yeah, how far you can go. Can you ever truly get off be off grid on a powerboat. Now I know I think even with Utah, people are doing electrical conversions and running solar. That’s awesome.

 

Talha [00:50:44] Coming around. Yeah, for sure. Yeah.

 

Andrew [00:50:46] But at the end of the day, I don’t ever have to have a motor if I don’t really want to. Just depends on how slow I’m willing to go or how long I’m willing to just bob out there in the middle. Nowhere. That’s what I love about sailing. It’s essentially free. Like if you have a water maker and you got a fishing pole, you kind of live out on the water forever if you really want to.

 

Talha [00:51:05] So, Andrew, we’re getting close to the end. Tell us a little bit. We didn’t talk too much about your racing adventures. Like how did you get into that? I mean, from a person who never sailed racing sailboats. Now what does that mean?

 

Andrew [00:51:18] I actually got into that when I when I was when I first got the boat and I was on the hard, I met another guy that was working on his boat right next to mine. You know, we got to be friends. And he said, You know, I got a buddy who owns a Pearson like my boat, a little bit newer, a little bit smaller. He said he races it. Are you interested? And I was like, I’m interested in every chance I get to get on the water. I don’t care what I’m doing. Yeah, I’m interested. Okay. So introduced to the guy, this guy Rudy. And he said, Yeah, we race every Wednesday night during the sailing seasons of the year. And he said, Come along, try out this. We seem like a good fit. You can keep racing with us. So I went out. Yeah, we, we all hit it off. Great crew. Consider them good friends now and we got every Wednesday night and we race and it’s the Little Creek Sailing Association So how many do something. Yeah, usually there’s a fleet. It ranges from 15 to 20 boats usually at a time from I’d say 30 feet upwards of 40. And we do. It’s usually about a three hour race every Wednesday night. The course always changes and we go out there and we just dominate every time.

 

Talha [00:52:29] And is it a rain or shine sort of deal?

 

Andrew [00:52:31] Yeah. The only limitation is if it’s blowing. 20 knots are greater than they cancel the race.

 

Talha [00:52:37] Just because boaters it’s not you like you’re like yeah. More with.

 

Andrew [00:52:41] Yeah. Yeah we do but I think it anyway I think it’s more in the sense of a 40 foot boat can handle 20 knots. No problem. A 30 foot boat? Not so much. So it becomes more of a Wow. That’s not very fair. Like, I physically can’t go out there without tearing up my boat. So I lost this, right? Because your boat is capable. That’s more why they do it. Yeah, it’s a blast, man. Like, there’s been times where it’s blowing like the devil out there, and we’re just ripping along eight, nine knots. And there’s also been times where in the middle of the race, the wind will just completely disappear. By the time or so. One race, we were out there about halfway through the course and the wind just stopped and the tide was coming in. So all the boats started drifting backwards. So to not lose ground because you’re in a race, you don’t want to lose ground. Everybody starts throwing out their anchors, stop the boats, drift backwards. And then it just turned into a big everybody jumped in the water and it was just a big slam party. It was a blast. But it’s complete insanity out there. I mean, I saw five or six boat collisions last season.

 

Talha [00:53:51] Oh, boy. In the race. Yeah.

 

Andrew [00:53:53] A couple of them. T-Bone hit them broadside. One of them was actually the last race of the season and one boat, T-boned another one. And he has bounced for it for the entire top of the cabin off the other boat.

 

Talha [00:54:06] Oh, ouch.

 

Andrew [00:54:07] I mean, it was done totaled the boat. So I think it’s intense. I’ve I’ve been within two inches of hitting another boat out there.

 

Talha [00:54:16] Wow. I mean, I was going to ask you, you’ve obviously learned a lot. What are some of the things that like racing taught you that everyday? Sailing what?

 

Andrew [00:54:23] How to trim sails, how to hit the optimal speed on your boat? The truth of the matter is, anybody can learn to sail. It’s not even that difficult. Put yourselves up. Point it in the direction and figure out if you’re going forward or not. Sailing’s pretty easy. Sailing Good. And knowing how to sell your boat to its full potential is extremely hard. That takes a lifetime of self-taught.

 

Talha [00:54:45] So we’ve got lots more questions, Andrew. So what is the body of water? Heat. Is it cheaper to live on a boat? I think we can sort of close with that and the sort of ABS website you recommend, these can sort of go hand in hand. They’re all going to sort of lead into each other, basically. Just five. Do you want to end with that or do you.

 

Merrill [00:55:01] Feel like we’ve done a ton of tips throughout.

 

Talha [00:55:03] The day? So many tips, too. And you sort of mentioned your water and your heat. Do you want to go in there again?

 

Merrill [00:55:10] So the age old question about owning a boat and living on it is, is it actually cheaper to live on a boat? So what’s your regard on that?

 

Andrew [00:55:20] So for me, yes, kind of depends on on what your what you want to do on the boat or your lifestyle in general. If you want a brand new beautiful boat. Yeah, that’s that’s quarter million dollars off the bat. If you want to live in a marina everywhere you go, you know, like I think I mentioned down in Florida, you know, marinas can run over $1,000 a month to stay. In that sense, it’s a lot more expensive to live on a boat for me right now. I’d say it’s about even, but that’s only because I throw everything I earn into my boat. Right now, I’m fixing it up to be 100% how I want it, which is not cheap. There’s a lot of big ticket items to buy, but in the long run, for me, it’s absolutely cheaper.

 

Talha [00:56:03] It’s almost virtually if you can get off grid the way you want to.

 

Andrew [00:56:07] Yeah. I mean, once I get to that point, all I’ve got to buy is a little bit of fuel for the dinghy and food. That’s it.

 

Talha [00:56:15] And everything. Yeah. Do you fish? Do you fish? Have you fished was your fishing experience.

 

Andrew [00:56:20] Yeah, I fish. So I’ve always grown up freshwater fishing and I fancied myself pretty good freshwater fisherman. I’ve done it my whole life so I can catch. I have attempted saltwater fishing a couple of times in life. One was just out on a charter where everybody catches something because you’re with the captain that knows where the boat down, where you’re going to catch fish. Also done some freshwater fishing here in the bay. Tall.

 

Talha [00:56:47] Saltwater.

 

Andrew [00:56:50] We went on a tournament.

 

Talha [00:56:51] Tournament right now.

 

Andrew [00:56:53] A Tortola fishing tournament. And that’s when I learned that I do not know how to fish for saltwater testing. It’s it’s a tricky beast.

 

Talha [00:57:08] And there’s definitely something we were missing.

 

Andrew [00:57:10] If you go into it like I did or you think. Yeah, I been freshwater fish and my whole life I go out there, no problem. It’s not the same. It’s completely different. The fish are different. What they eat is different. Little tricks you got to do. It’s every fish, it seems like, has its own little trick to catching it for us. That day we were fishing and try to catch Todd Todd And so a couple people that I know that have fresh fish in the bay, their whole lives were like, Give me tips on how to catch dog, you know, drop your your loo or let it hit the bottom and just bounce it across the bottom. They live in the rocks down there. And so that’s what I was trying. I still didn’t have any luck. But I get the sense that every every saltwater fish kind of has its own unique little trick and you have to learn all those tricks. And even then, it takes a lifetime of a long time of doing it, because why we didn’t catch anything. At most everybody else, they’ve been fish in the bay their whole life, came back with buckets full of fish.

 

Talha [00:58:09] Yeah, they knew exactly what to do and how to do it.

 

Andrew [00:58:12] And they are in the same spot.

 

Talha [00:58:13] We were up and we were in the same spot. So then so on a final note and just as a final tip, you’ve given us so many tips, but what are maybe your favorite apps or websites that just make this whole thing much more doable?

 

Andrew [00:58:27] So for me, some of the main websites I frequent right now and that’s because I’m in total boat renovation mode, is sites like Defender for all my rigging. I used rigging only dot com. They had great prices and great products. Just got into a site called Mara Pro that I’ve been replacing all my my running rigging and their prices are good and their equipment is good. So those are the my main go tos. I still watch selling Zouma religiously because we got the same boat and I, I just think what they’re doing is fantastic. I think they’re one of the true sailors selling sell, sell boat YouTube channels out there. They’re doing stuff that nobody else is doing. And I, I kind of feed off. Their passion is equal to my passion. So those are the main ones.

 

Talha [00:59:19] And then for like weather, what’s your favorite weather?

 

Andrew [00:59:21] So I use Wendy a lot, but with Wendy, I’ve learned to add about five knots or whatever they say, because usually the wind’s blowing a little bit more. I love Navy Onyx. I just haven’t started paying for it yet, but I should because it’s fantastic. Some of the other ones I use. Let me check here. I use an app called Marine Traffic. A lot.

 

Talha [00:59:45] Of actually.

 

Andrew [00:59:45] Rain traffic will show you other boats that have their ass turned on, which is important, especially when you’re sailing at night or when. So back it was I think it was January I went. For a day sale. And it was the fog was thick, sick. I mean, you couldn’t see 20 feet in front of a boat. And we’re selling through the bay up to Hampton Cross and channels. So I was the only one that had marine traffic turned on. And I’m watching other boats out there that have their air sacs on. And I see well, there’s a big container ship crossing the channel right in front of us. About as soon as I said that the captain of that ship got on the radio and called us out, you know, small pleasure craft. What are your what are your intentions? And within minutes, I mean, there was it looked like a 20 storey building, like 50 feet in front of us. And wow, that is a must have app if you don’t have a on your your boat already. So yeah, those, those are some of the main ones I use. I use know us sometimes to, to watch the weather but they want you to pay for their app so I don’t use that a ton.

 

Merrill [01:00:55] Well Andrew, it was amazing to talk to you. A ton of tips. So damn good job.

 

Andrew [01:01:03] Hopefully I help somebody out out there that’s wanting to go this route. But best tip, make sure it’s an obsession.

 

Talha [01:01:11] That get into if you love it. I agree with that.

 

Andrew [01:01:13] If you don’t have to live on a boat, you can enjoy sailing around. But if you’re going to live on it, be obsessed with it because it’s going to take every bit of it.

 

Talha [01:01:21] I really appreciate it and we hope to have you back on the show perhaps in the future. And thank you so much for everything that you shared with us and good luck.

 

Andrew [01:01:30] Yeah, I loved it. Thanks guys for having me.

 

Talha [01:01:32] Shipshape accrual the number one resource in the U.S. for marine professionals.